What Excites Us!

Episode 70 : From Purity Culture to Boudoir Photographer with Wren Morrow

Transcript:

[00:00:20] Hello and welcome to What Excites Us! My name is Gwyn Isaacs. I am a clinical certified sexologist who's been working with folks professionally since 2017. And because of that, I can tell you with as surety that pleasure is the key to everything, and desire is the map that gets you there.

[00:00:46] Gwyn: Today my guest is Wren Morrow. We talk about her journey from purity culture to boudoir photographer, although boudoir is really not quite right. She takes you on a journey through unveiling your wild side, your precious side, whatever side it is that needs to come out in nature. Her pictures are amazing and I definitely dote on her little bit the beginning, so I won't do that again here. But think about big swings and listening to your intuition as you're listening to this conversation.

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[00:02:31] Gwyn: I am joined by Wren Morrow, an outdoor boudoir and erotic adventure photographer based in the Pacific Northwest. But calling her work photography feels a little bit too small because she also guides individuals and couples through deeply embodied and central experiences in wild places.

[00:02:53] Now, you all might not know this, and Wren, you might not know this, but I am a little bit of an art slut, and I even fancied myself a photographer for a minute. So believe me when I say that Wren's images live somewhere between fine art and fairytale. They're moody, wild, sensual, and deeply honest. And what makes her work so powerful isn't just how it looks. It is clear how it feels to be seen through her lens and how deeply empowering that must be to be one of your subjects.

[00:03:28] Now, raised in the buckle of the Bible Belt Wren's early life was shaped by religious dogma and purity culture. She worked in the church, married a worship pastor, and spent years trying to decipher what she had been told was God's plan for her body and for her life until 2016, she chose a different story. I am so deeply delighted to chat with you today, Wren can we start with what happened and how you made that decision?

[00:03:59] Wren Morrow: I had to leave Chattanooga, Tennessee.

[00:04:02] Gwyn: Uh huh.

[00:04:04] Wren Morrow: Oh my goodness. Uh, I feel like. It was, it was a compounding situation where I just kept trying to surrender and, and, and out God's plan for me. meanwhile, my husband lost his job. My ex-husband lost his job. he left the entire financial responsibility on me. And I was taught to be a submissive wife. So I just kept getting more jobs. I was working four jobs, like 85 hours a week. I wasn't sleeping. I was a husk of a human. I was just absolutely burnt out. And I came home one day he was asleep at like 2:00 PM when like what he was doing for work was like working for Uber. And I was like, what are you doing? And he was just like, oh, well. I just assumed while you were making all this extra money that, that I could just focus on my, on my music. And I was like, did you spend extra money? Like my jaw dropped and I was like, okay, we need to spend like three months of where we are separated.

[00:05:23] I'm moving out. You're gonna need to figure out how to pay for your half of your, your bills, your half a rent, like, everything like that. And he was like, how am I gonna afford that? And I was like, exactly. And with that, I suddenly, like, as I moved into this new season where I continued to work all these hours and just stack paper because he wasn't spending all my money behind my back.

[00:05:46] And that was like a whole other thing. And I started to just like, feel myself come online. I started, running and just like with friends and my life shifted so much. And then before we had separated, had like signed up for a credit card so I could get all these points and book us a, a trip to Italy. So I had this trip to Italy on the books and was like, okay, well I guess I'm going by myself. And went and a two week vacation. Um, had, I just had this like chance encounter on a train with this guy who I didn't even spend any time with there. We just had like this small conversation I texted him when I got back to the States and he was like, how are things?

[00:06:33] I'm like, really terrible. I don't know if I want to, at this point, my husband had gotten a job, but it was two, two and a half hours away from my hometown. And I was like, I don't know if I, if I want to like reconcile with him and have to move my whole life or get a divorce and stay in this tiny town, like, I, I hate all of my options. And he was like, well, what would you do if you could do anything? I was like, I don't know. I'd probably go back to Italy. I was having an amazing time. He was like, if you wanted to, you could come live with me for free. And I was like, like a sex slave? Like, what are you? And he was just like, okay, I'm definitely attracted to you, but you just, I'm more fascinated by your energy and who you are, and just seem like this would be a cool opportunity for you. So, when the option was to Italy for free, I said, okay, I'll do that one. So I filed for divorce. on a one way flight to Italy. I only lived there for about four months and I, I'm just having like the most amazing time.

[00:07:43] Um, I actually come back to the States to get legal and realized how much I had missed laughing with people, which is a funny thing, but even as I was learning so much, Italian humor is one of the last things to really translate. 'Cause it's so much about like culture and context and all these things. So I came back and was like, oh my goodness, I've missed my friends. I've missed laughing. Um, but I'm still in this small town where I'd gone through a divorce. Trump has just gotten elected. I'm like, I gotta get outta here. And I had been to Seattle when I was in college and thought it was a fascinating town, but I just knew that that was like way too big of a move.

[00:08:27] So, I had met these guys who were from the, from a town called Port Angeles on the Olympic Peninsula and messaged them. I was like, I don't know if you remember me, I was your server like two years ago, but I wanna get out to the West Coast and I'm wondering, can you help me with a job? Can you help me with a place to live? Like, what able to connect me with anyone? And he was like, oh my goodness, I definitely remember you. Um, I actually own a bar and restaurant out here. You were amazing. You could totally come work for me. My best friend just bought an apartment complex. It's like a five minute walk away, so I, I'll put in a good word for you. So I reached out on April 3rd. By April 7th I had a job and a place to live lined up. And by April 27th, I had bought a minivan, sold all my things that wouldn't fit in it, and then made this journey to the West Coast.

[00:09:25] I feel like during that west was really a potent time for me. I have heard people say so many times, like, know, wherever you go, there you are. And I didn't want to be, I knew I was running, I wanted to be running on purpose and like, know what, okay, I knew I was running from something, what am I also running towards? about like the midway point, I was at the Grand Canyon and I just like hard stopped myself and just like, let everything catch up with me, all my shame from my divorce. Uh, there's so much, um, in religious culture about that being so important. And like if you get a divorce, you're an ultimate failure.

[00:10:15] And I was, I was a baby. I was like 26. I was just like, no one will ever love me again. I'm a divorcee. Like, I was just like letting all that catch up with me, seeing the ways that had not like been a good friend to people who had tried to be in my corner. At that same time when I walked away from religion, I didn't realize how much of my morality had come from this idea of burning in hell.

[00:10:45] I was like 25 years old and having to determine my own moral compass for the first time. I didn't have one. I was just like, oh, whatever God, you know, no God, no consequences. And so I was like being real flippant with the way I was treating people, with the relationship entanglements I was getting in. so just like letting all of the shame of that catch up with me. I say that like I was restarting my life there and I had this blank canvas, but the only mediums I had were like chaos and pain. And so I started making this canvas and it was like, ugh.

[00:11:25] So really seeing that and being like, okay, how do I want it to feel moving forward? How, who am I connecting with? How am I spending my time? What does it feel like? And I wanted it to feel nourishing and grounded and adventurous and inspired and creative. And so like really locking into that. And I was grateful for the fact that the week took, or the trip took me like two weeks because, you know, at first I was just like, and then like, then it was like, okay, wait, hold on. What, what the fuck are we doing? And why are we doing it? And I think that that made all the difference to end up in this life that had a deep sense of meaning and purpose for me. So.

[00:12:10] Gwyn: That's. Amazing.

[00:12:15] Wren Morrow: Yeah,

[00:12:15] Gwyn: So much of that story is amazing. So going back a little bit, purity culture is really intense, right? So how were you able to really untangle yourself relatively quickly from all of that?

[00:12:39] Wren Morrow: Well, I mean, I wouldn't say I'm all the way untangled. Let's be clear. Like it's still, if I leave myself unmedicated, and by medicated I mean like spending time with quality friends, spending lots of time outside spending like, uh, time moving my body and like the things that like truly nourish me. But if I spend too much time not then that those old patternings are still there and still like offer themselves as a. a tasty little mental loop should I, engage.

[00:13:15] I mean, it, it was really intense. My parents, God bless 'em, were really determined to make sure that like I wasn't affected by the world., So I was homeschooled because of that. I had all these like really intense, ideas of like saving myself for my husband. Like I was like 12 years old. And they encouraged me to start like writing letters to my husband, letting him know I was saving myself For him, thinking about him, dreaming about him.

[00:13:46] It created a lot of like fantasy around what it meant to be a good wife and, and how the ultimate thing that you can give anyone is your body. And it's like this, it's this crazy dichotomy of your body is your most precious thing. And then also like this like intense amount of responsibility of like, and you need to cover it and like never be causing anyone to stumble by it and like hold all of the responsibility for making sure that brothers don't stumble.

[00:14:24] Like as far as how I untangled it, I feel like it was just this slow unraveling. Spending a lot of time naked in nature with my ex-partner. Uh, he and I lived in a van together, and all he ever wanted to do was find the quietest places where you could hear no cars and no planes and no people, and just like, go to these places where there was nothing but the sound of the earth. Then he was a musician and he would just try to like very softly, gently like layer in something that felt like it belonged there.

[00:15:08] And so, because we were like in these like ultra secluded parts, uh, just taking off our clothes was the thing that just made the most sense. You know, we're just like, we're outside it's warm, we're skinny dipping. And he was both a witness to me and of me during that time. But also he spent a lot of time just kind of like leaving me to my own devices. And I just feel like spending all of that time out there really just like kind of slowly bit by bit, there was no external pressure to look any sort of way when it's just like you and the trees, you know, there's no like shrubbery on like, oh, I'm gaining a little weight there.

[00:15:49] Or like, don't have to dress dress any certain way or like, worry about being perceived. I think that sometimes we're so anxious about the way that we're being perceived and trying to be perceived the way that we want to be perceived, that we're like in this like, fun house of mirrors of just like, okay, what am I seeing?

[00:16:10] Oh, is that how you're seeing me? Wait, no. Let me adjust, let me adjust, let me adjust. And there was no adjustment necessary. And truly wild places are messy and, imperfect. And all those imperfections are just story. And you see this tree that's grown up all like crooked, and you're just like, oh my goodness.

[00:16:32] I would just see, I'm like, oh, like you were seeking light and you couldn't find it here, so you had to like move over. Or like, oh, this one like, looks like this rock fell on it. And now it's like whole shape shifted and like, just seeing, you know, the ways that like rivers are formed just by like following the path of least resistance. I, I think that this combination of both not being perceived by anything had any sort of like, thought or expectation of how I needed to look and witnessing how absolutely undeniably magical these things look that are not fitting conventional understandings of like, perfection. Like shame and, and the purity culture just like created like all these knots, you know?

[00:17:30] And like trying to like tear through them wasn't working, but it, that, that just like created this like softening that allowed them to like, oh, I can like slip my arm out of that. That doesn't have to be a part of me that doesn't, that thinking doesn't have to like confine me.

[00:17:48] Gwyn: Makes a lot of sense and the leaning towards what you enjoy doing, um, as opposed to. Just not doing the things that you are not doing anymore or not supposed to be doing, or whatever the shame creates to, uh, shut us down. Right. Um, yeah. Instead of trying to delete the negative, just adding the positive makes a lot of sense to.

[00:18:16] Wren Morrow: totally. And it, and you like focus on that positive for long enough and I think that a lot of the masculine approach to problems is like this, like head on, very conflict forward way that, builds a lot of strength of character. And I think that that seems to be very important to the masculine identity is like. building of strength and the way you build strength is through resistance. And so, like, attacking the problem head on is this very like masculine strength building. And the feminine approach, I feel like is like slick little, like, oh, that's like not even a problem anymore. Like, now I'm existing in this paradigm where I'm like, I'm not even thinking about it.

[00:19:02] Gwyn: I really love that and I'm gonna, I'm gonna let that spin around my noodle for a while about the, the masculine. Yeah, the masculine versus the feminine approach and how that is really shaped. So much of our culture and, um, everything around us, and then, and then it infiltrates us and how we are trying to do things because that is all we know.

[00:19:27] And so stepping outside of that is so scary for so many people. And that's my whole thing is pleasure. It's all about what feels good, leaning into what feels good, doing more of what feels good, because it'll help build all of the other stuff. So the fact that that came up pretty soon in our conversation is pretty exciting for me.

[00:19:46] Um, you also talked about undoing of yourself and finding who you are now, the, um, the noticing of nature and how it's not perfect. And, and then translating that to yourself, I presume is what, what you were saying. And then I noticed on your website you talk about, being naked in nature as medicine. Talk a little bit more about that.

[00:20:09] Wren Morrow: Oh my goodness. I'm just saying the first time. That you like, I dunno, I dunno how to say this. first time that you get a breeze on the LABAs is like absolutely a different experience. You have entered into a different realm. are so many people that I know that have never skinny dipped in their life. Like, oh my goodness. I go in with like my bathing suit on, like I, I'll go into whatever, and I'm like, no dude. You don't understand. There is something, I can't explain it you know, you know, if you have ever like had something where you are, bits are just out and experiencing. What it is to just be out.

[00:21:02] Like it's different. It hits different, it like activates something in me feels so primal and so like, like this, like this is it. This is what we're talking about, feeling. It's so freeing. it just reminds you of the animal aspect of yourself, as we've gotten with thinking that our minds are the most powerful thing that we have. Our bodies are so powerful and they hold so much intelligence that's been passed down like forever and always, like since the beginning. I'm amazed at how easy it is to access it, in like the act, you know, the act of just like being naked outside, is it?

[00:22:00] I mean, like that doesn't, it costs you nothing, you know, it costs you a drive, but like you always have your body on you, you know? Um, and yet how few people have done it, because it isn't acceptable in our cities, nor would it hit the same, it just like, it isn't acceptable.

[00:22:18] And so, so many people like don't have access to this. Just like, oh my goodness, like, I belong here. I belong to this natural world. I am the nature. And I'm not like putting anything as like this block between me and what's here. It's like it is just me. Myself as myself. No pretenses, no. Like, you know, my, my fashion is not carrying any of the weight of this presentation. no marketing happening here. Like, this is just me. and then to be surrounded by all of these other beings who are also just them, it the level of just like, oh, oh, right, is this, is, is, so beyond words is ineffable, but you've, if you know it, you know it.

[00:23:25] Gwyn: I didn't own a bathing suit for years and years and years. Um, I lived in Vermont and so I could just go to all the little ponds and quarries that I could go to. And then I had children and I'm not taking a child to a quarry 'cause that's terrifying. Um,

[00:23:40] Wren Morrow: Yeah.

[00:23:42] Gwyn: Really sad when I had to get a bathing suit again. I was like, damn it. Okay, fine.

[00:23:47] Wren Morrow: Right.

[00:23:48] Gwyn: So yeah, it, it's this amazing, uh, extremely freeing experience, especially for those of us who are in bodies that are, um, less than ideal, which is nonsense. And, and we don't even have to go there, but like, um. Yeah, the, all of the, the shame just sort of dissipates because it doesn't really matter.

[00:24:11] Wren Morrow: mm-hmm.

[00:24:12] Gwyn: Tell us about your photography and, bringing other women out into the wilderness and, and the pictures that you take and what exp All the experiences just go.

[00:24:23] Wren Morrow: Yeah. Um, I, I feel like I kind of stumbled into it. I think it was like a combination of like, I was spending so much time outside. I was finding these beautiful places. I was getting started as a photographer and I was doing like content for bars and restaurants and whatnot. I think there was just, there was something in me that had seen the way that. Uh, that a woman would just like blossom if given the right container. I think the word is fluorescence, which is like the actual, like blooming of a thing. And I started to just see that in the way that I did photography with anyone, no matter who was in front of my lens or, or what we were capturing. Just kind of like having this, um, I'm a very sensitive person. I'm very empathetic. thanks trauma for my superpowers. Um, just being able to kind of like see a person and kind of like tease, tease them out of their shell a little bit and hold that space and be patient enough and just, I just kind of like stumbled into it and then it, it just, it just snowballed really.

[00:25:42] And feel like I was operating from this resonance of like having these amazing adventures and spending time outside and be like, come with me. Come on, let's go. Like, it'll be an adventure.

[00:25:55] It just felt so organic that I was just like, magnetizing these people coming out of the woodwork from Texas. And I found you like, what? How? Even like, you know, it's like word of mouth I made sense, but these people, I'm just like, you, you're coming out of the woodwork, truly. I feel like I was just vibrating so much at this like. Empowered, embodied, bold, freedom seeking, adventure, having like, I was just having so much fun, so I was like, come have fun with me. Come, let's play. And it was resonating with people and, um, and does still resonate with people to, have access to this thing. And, and I feel like, you know, the idea of going outside and playing naked in nature, I think that it, there are some people that I'm like, they're like, oh yeah, I would do that.

[00:26:50] And there's some people that are like, I, I could never in a million years see myself doing that. But the power of photography is that you're able to show what it looks like and like, and then you, you are able to start to see yourself doing that and you are like, oh my goodness, wait, that looks like really fun.

[00:27:07] I don't know, but, but I think I could do that too. And I just consider myself like the, a guide to just like, help, give the permission, I think that there's like an energetic exchange that happens, with exchanging money of like creating a container of like consent like, you gotta like, put some skin in the game to really like pull yourself like, I am gonna do this. So there's like that aspect alone, I think charges women up to like, take their own liberation seriously and take this opportunity seriously. It's been such a like, fun variety of shoots because I'm always like really interested in like how people would play with this space.

[00:27:53] Like, okay, I'll go anywhere. Where do you want to go? Like, are we going to the ocean? Are we going to a forest? Are we going to the river? Like where, what element of nature do you feel is your like, spirit animal? Like for better, you know, like, like where do you resonate? Where do you feel powerful? Where do you feel like you can drop in?

[00:28:20] Where. I've been so amazed at the way that I, I really do feel like I'm in Kahoots with Mother Nature on this thing. 'cause I've had a girl be like, I was born in a blizzard and I'm hoping that a blizzard will happen. blizzard that has ever happened on a, on a photo shoot happened for her. Like one girl was like, I really love like, the drama of like a powerful storm. Okay, cool. Storm came in, storm rolled in, no water fell from the sky. We only have it as like a backdrop, you know, like people like me. Of course , there have been some times where I've shifted a date, but the amount of times that the weather has been exactly what we were calling for, not just calling for sun, but like calling for snow, calling for like storm clouds.

[00:29:14] And just think that that has been so cool to see what elements people really connect with and then trying to like, cultivate an experience around that, really get a sense for like, how do you see yourself in power. And how can I like, reflect that back to you? Do you need to be just like loose and free and like you've, like unshackled yourself from like, the shame of your own mind? are you like broody? Is it just really fucking sexy or is it like how do you feel powerful, but also how do you feel beautiful? You know, like some of it is like a lot more, almost like taken from this. Like, I've, I stumbled upon you in this magic place and like, oops, see, like don't disturb the fairy while she is working her magic and helping the flowers grow.

[00:30:11] I think there's so many ways to play and it's such a fun space to see what intrigues somebody to what energy intrigues somebody to embody. Then these photos, because the, the emphasis and the process is so focused on, helping you embody the energy that makes you feel the most powerful, beautiful, magnetic then. The focus of the shoot is helping you to feel that much of that energy as possible. And then these photos just end up becoming keys to like unlock that feeling whenever you need it, whenever you've forgotten, whenever you lose your way. These, these photos are like, oh yeah, I am that bitch.

[00:31:00] Gwyn: Can you see the shift in people from when you get in the car or whatever to when they get there? And, and, and, and I imagine that the first couple of things are a little stiff. And then do you watch the unfolding happen? Yeah.

[00:31:17] Wren Morrow: Yes. 1000000%. 1000000%. That's like the, the funnest part of it is that, I think some people approach boudoir, like very formulaic like very like, okay, we're gonna this pose and this pose 'cause this makes you feel sex, or this, this looks sexy. You know, like if you have this arc and this thing and point this toe. I'm gonna take a thousand photos. They're gonna get like 75. we're gonna like, move, move through this energy, like actually move through it. And so yes, everybody's super stiff at first. I'm, I'm stiff at first. I'm warming up. What's the light setting?

[00:31:58] Where are we? Like, what, you know, how are we breathing? How are we living today? then as I go and we all get more comfortable with it, and then I do a, I don't know if there's mixed reviews on photographers that do this, but I'll, I'll show the photos. Like once I've got that first one that I'm like, oh yeah, that's what we're talking about. I'll, I'll show them. That is the first thing that makes people like, oh, wait, that's me. No way, girl. No way. And, and you see this thing happens like, okay, now, now you actually trust me. You were like giving me the benefit of the doubt. We were working with things, but then when I show you how you can look and like what I can do and how we're working together, then now we've unlocked trust and now we're just cruising through the shoot.

[00:32:47] And then by the end, I mean, it is just like we are laughing. We are, we've cried most likely. Like it is just this, like truly a blossoming of energy. I don't put a time limit on my shoots because I, I don't want anyone to feel in a, in a box for how long they have to perform. Well, for me. We're gonna, we're gonna do it until you feel the way I know you're capable of feeling. 'cause it's inside all of us. Inside for some of us is a little bit more deep, a little more buried, a little bit more like, but inside all of us is this like, I am fucking beautiful. I am so magical. I am radiance itself. I am like the spirit of everything. Choosing to wrap itself up into a little body that's able to experience pleasure.

[00:33:50] Feeling of sun on your skin, on wind, on your cheek, like leaning into that. You don't have to fake an orgasm for me to like look hot on this photo. Like feel what is your birthright to feel. This body that you have is only job is to be in, in intaking the information and, and interpreting the data. Like that's what we're doing here. And so like feel into that data babes, like feel into how soft that moss is, feel into how, how cold the snow is and how electric it is to have this space spaceship has given you so much data to work with and to feel and experience and interpret as pleasure. start tapping into that man, you're, it is some other shit, right.

[00:34:50] Gwyn: It's so sexy. It's so like, mm. So yeah, totally hot and energizing and I, yes, I love it. Absolutely love it. So what is the, the process, it sounds like you have a, a decent, like before you even go somewhere, decide what to do process. Do you sit down and talk with the folks? Or how does it go from like beginning to end?

[00:35:14] Wren Morrow: Mm. so the beginning is that I get an inquiry form, and on my inquiry I have some of those like preliminary questions of like, you know, where do you imagine this? Is it like hyper-specific, like you need to go to the redwoods, or are we just trying to go to a beach like. you know, get like a general sense of the mood there. Um, one of my favorite questions that's on my inquiry form is, um, what is a poem or quote that recently made you feel really alive? And I've been so delighted by how many incredible quotes have come to me through that question.

[00:35:56] And also what, like a interesting peep into their, their world and, and what they're holding and resonating with at this time is. And then from there it's normally a combination of emails or phone calls, depending on scheduling. either conversations, emails, or kind of a combination of the two.

[00:36:18] we end up talking a lot about the location. Um, sometimes people to go to a specific place that has a lot of meaning for them, which is always a treat for me to get to to some place I've never been before. I, I love doing that, especially if it holds some significance for them. We talk a lot about just the overall, like themes we're trying to capture energy, we're resonating with. Then we end up like texting a lot for, outfit consultations. Like, do you think this looks good? What do you think about this? You know? And, and my response to that is always like, if you feel good in it and you think it's a, maybe bring it we might not use everything, but I would rather have it than not have it.

[00:37:07] And most of my shoots are not, uh, too far away from a car, or I'll, I'm out here backpacked up, I'm carrying it all. Then it's just like picking the date, building anticipation, talking through nerves and stuff as they come up. I mean, anytime you make some big, bold beep of faith that like, you know. I'm, I'm so freaking beautiful and worthy that I'm worth like, booking this, you know, a thousand dollars shoot and being celebrated and seen and naked and like, you know, understandably we get closer to time. You're like, wait, I'm sorry. Wait, what am I, what, who did I think I was? And so it's not out of pocket for me to kind of do a little bit of coaching and just reassuring that nervousness and excitement read in the body, the, in that same buzziness.

[00:38:04] So that, that buzz means that something matters to you that you're onto something. creating the capacity for curiosity on the buzz and curiosity for what it means and harnessing that is, is how, uh, we're gonna move, through it. So I think I do a lot of that.

[00:38:25] Sometimes I've gone on backpacking trips with people to get to somewhere. Sometimes it's just like a day hike, depending on the energy or like the location, sometimes we gotta figure out are we doing a sunset, sunrise, somewhere in between. We've had to do like last minute logistical plans realizing like, oh, that place is closed. What, what's nearby where we can still find a waterfall? I think just having a lot of flexibility and adaptability, which are definitely two of my strongest suits have been imperative because there's a lot of needing to think on the fly.

[00:38:59] Yeah, then, then we're off to the races. But yeah, then we, then we go to the location and it's like typically, I mean, at that point we're in the wild, you know, so it's like we're chasing light, we're, we're seeing what's working. Um, all of the outfits that we, that the clients bring, I'm normally like, oh, okay. Wait, this one looks really good in, in this zone. Let's like do this one here. Let's do that one over there. Okay. This one we're gonna get wet in. Okay. We'll do that at the end. And so a lot of that ends up being, really feeling really conversational, uh, with both me and the client, but also me and, and nature and just like, this is the spot that we wanna hit when the sun is at that point, you know?

[00:39:43] So we'll circle back to it. And just finding little like hidden gems, uh, by, by way of light and just like following the light, is always really magical because, it's always shifting. And even like locations I've been to many times, I'm like, oh dang. Like, you know, it looks totally different in this season.

[00:40:04] Or like, you know, I'd never been here in fall. And suddenly like, we have got to go to that oak tree to be with those colors. So, yeah. And then after the shoot. There's lot of like, wow, my goodness. And, um, and then I typically take, uh, three to five weeks to return the gallery to them.

[00:40:27] And then it's a whole other level of, oh my goodness, I can't believe that was me. and after that, I mean, I feel like I've become friends with at least 60% of my clients. And, and even the ones I don't talk to regularly, like I know I could hit them up at any time and be like, girl, how are you doing? You know?

[00:40:48] And so it's, feel like a, after that it becomes, uh, really relational. Um, 'cause you can't through such an intimate time with somebody and not be pretty bonded. I think so,

[00:41:01] Gwyn: Yeah, for sure, I used to live in a clothing optional apartment complex and part of mm-hmm. Yeah. And the whole thing was like, I was it, I lived in Las Vegas and it, it was the only place that I ever lived in Las Vegas where it felt like community. And a big part of that is it's hard to be an asshole when your dick is hanging out, right? Like, if you are naked to go do your laundry, because why wouldn't you be?

[00:41:32] Right? Like it's, it's, and, and I'm not friends with all those people. Um, but if I ran into them on the street, I'd probably say hi, you know? And I did make friends with my next door neighbors, like really good friends with them. Um, because yeah, you are. Instantly intimate. Not in a deeply intimate way, but it sounds like with what you are doing, you are in a much deeper, intimate, uh, exchange of, of joyousness

[00:42:02] Wren Morrow: Hmm.

[00:42:04] Gwyn: and, and

[00:42:05] Wren Morrow: idea that y'all just have nothing to hide. You know, like, you just automatically have to, you know, there's no pretending here where your dick's out, sir. Like, there's no, like, that's, that's amazing. How long did you live there for?

[00:42:21] Gwyn: Not long enough. Um, a year, I think. I think I did a, a, a year. Yeah. And it doesn't exist anymore. Um, and it was,

[00:42:32] Wren Morrow: should,

[00:42:32] Gwyn: I think, the last one in the country at that point. And that was late eighties, early nineties, somewhere in there. So

[00:42:42] Wren Morrow: it sounds like you should petition for one in Brooklyn.

[00:42:46] Gwyn: Uh, sure. You wanna help me buy an apartment building?

[00:42:51] Wren Morrow: I'm just saying you just get everybody on board, you know, like go around,

[00:42:55] Gwyn: I would. No, it would have to be very intentional. Um,

[00:43:01] Wren Morrow: Yeah.

[00:43:02] Gwyn: intentional. And I actually, like, one of the things that I fantasize about is buying a small apartment building, um, because it would be nice to have more solid roots, and I hate the fact that my rent goes up every year. So, you know, that would sort of be a thing.

[00:43:19] And I'm a pretty good landlord. And the idea of buying an intentional community, that sounds kind of fun. Sure, we'll put that on the list.

[00:43:26] Wren Morrow: Put it on the dream board. Put it on the vision board.

[00:43:30] Gwyn: Exactly. I am a big fan of vision boards. Um, so when you are actually shooting, you said that you don't have a, a, a, a rock solid time span, but on the average, how long do you think that you're out there once you're actually on location and, and shooting shots?

[00:43:47] Wren Morrow: Yeah, probably between two and four hours, depending

[00:43:50] Gwyn: Okay.

[00:43:50] Wren Morrow: how, how far we were hiking. Obviously, if we gotta get to the, you know, like the, like, not including drive time, so there's like drive

[00:44:00] Gwyn: Right.

[00:44:01] Wren Morrow: there's also, do we need to hike up, you know, hike

[00:44:06] Gwyn: Yeah.

[00:44:08] Wren Morrow: I don't know if you've seen some of the ones I have where the girl was like, okay, I'm trying to hit the top of this mountain by sunrise.

[00:44:15] And I was like, okay, we're leaving the house at 3:00 AM we gotta make it happen. So, yeah, there's, uh, yeah, I would say between two and four hours. um, and there's also like, we're, we're taking little breaks too, you know, where like I typically bring in Oracle deck. Um. We'll do like a little reading and just like trying to like settle into this space.

[00:44:43] And like I said, like for me, a lot of the medicine is just spending the time outside. And so I'm, I consider myself more like I'm facilitating you to have access to this thing that I know is going to be very good for you. You know, I'm gonna take your picture, but I can't hold the space necessary by myself. Or it, it would be unwise of me to try to hold that space alone.

[00:45:18] I think that, uh, there was a long time in my life where I considered going to school for therapy. And I never was intrigued by the idea of having somebody come and sit in an isolated from their relationships where the things get triggered, isolated from, you know, whatever else, to come and sit in my sterilized container with just me on a couch and talk to me about their problems. Because no human has enough capacity to hold somebody through that without going through burnout. What they need is to like get rooted into something that's bigger than them. And whether you believe in a God or not, like you cannot go to the woods and, stay hyper fixated on your own bullshit. Like it is undeniable that there's a lot more going on than just my tiny little story.

[00:46:24] And that shift by itself is so potent. And then to just be held and be perfect just as you are because of all of the other examples of all these other things that are perfect just the way they are. It's like, I'm almost like the excuse you to go and spend the time that, and, and do it with a friend. Like, that's the other thing is like just trying to go out there by yourself and just like, okay, like I wanna feel better.

[00:46:56] You know? Like that can also like, not necessarily be the ticket, but you go and, and you just go play with a friend outside, like, ugh. I know you grew up in a, in a time even more. I, I feel like I'm one of the last ones that would just go play outside with my friends as a kid. You know, like these days I don't even see, I don't know if kids do that anymore. And I'm, I'm sure like when you were a kid it was happening even more. And I think like that, that is we're trying to get into. That's what, that's where I don't even wanna call it healing. It's like, just remembering happens.

[00:47:35] Gwyn: what would you say to someone who is intrigued and terrified all at the same time, about stepping into this process with you?

[00:47:46] Wren Morrow: Well, you're certainly not alone. Yeah, it's, I, I don't, don't know if I've worked with anyone who didn't have at least some measure of terror. I think the only person that I did that I feel like brought none to the table was this girl who wanted to work with me for like three years. And she would always be like, okay, I'm going one of these days, I'm gonna have enough self-confidence to book you.

[00:48:19] And I'm like, you just let me know when, you know. And I just kind of kept holding that, like, just tell me when. Then the day that she hit me up, like she knew she was ready, she was like. I'm ready. She was like, I, I woke up the other day I looked in the mirror doing my rituals of, telling myself something nice. And she was like, I didn't even have to think about it. I just told myself how beautiful my eyelashes look today. she's like, so I knew I was ready and I was like, God, been out here doing the work. You've been out here. Like, that is so powerful. That's so powerful.

[00:48:55] But to anyone else, I, feel like it, it is, this, almost like this ritual of aligned action, where, you know, you want, if you're intrigued that that means that there's a part of you that is ready to take that step. And then the hesitation makes sense. The hesitation isn't, uh, indication of. Oh, I shouldn't actually be doing this, but just that, that there's not a hundred percent of you is on board. And so there's just like an opportunity to, to sit with those hesitations, you know, name them who, who, part of me is so sad?

[00:49:40] What part of me is so scared? What part of me doesn't feel like I'm worthy of something like this? If I think it's so beautiful other people get to do it, but like, Why is it that I don't think that I'm worth getting to do something like this for, and keep asking why? And really like, pull those parts out and, let 'em have a seat at the table and take their fear under advisement, you know. Like okay I see you little, little 13-year-old me who was like, made fun of for, being that goofy girl in class or whatever. I see you like, I understand why you're so scared. But like we're different now and we've come a long way and, and we can and should celebrate that. And so then, then it is this opportunity when you're trying to build a new belief about yourself, important to take an action that confirms that belief. You can't just sit there in the mirror every single day. I am this, I am this, I am this.

[00:50:51] That's part of it. But then to pair that with an action that has your brain like actually get the confirmation of like, I am so freaking beautiful and amazing and worth celebrating. I am worth celebrating. They the end, I'm worth celebrating. Okay, how much are you worth celebrating? Are you worth celebrating this dollar amount, this time amount, this energetic investment amount? And then you say, yeah, yes I am. Well now you've, you've paired it with something and now your brain is like, oh, damn, maybe I am worth celebrating. Look all that for me.

[00:51:32] Like, and so I think that that would be that, yeah, you're not alone. Um, spend the time with the, with the parts of you that are scared, but realize that they are only one voice at your table. They're not the entire council that you are required to take under advisement. And recognize it as an opportunity to, combine belief you're cultivating with aligned action to cement it into your psyche.

[00:52:05] Gwyn: Amazing. Yeah, you are. Your photography is beautiful. Your energy is beautiful, and the fact that you can put those things into words makes it as if your coaching is also beautiful because that is clearly what you are also doing,

[00:52:24] Wren Morrow: There's that, I'll be, I became a therapist. All the same. No. Yes,

[00:52:32] Gwyn: the licensure and the, uh, very rigid rules. Um,

[00:52:37] Wren Morrow: yes. They way. We get to go outside and play and keep hitting the shade, but yeah.

[00:52:46] Gwyn: yeah. Um. Have I missed anything? Is there anything that you want to be sure to talk about that we haven't?

[00:52:56] Wren Morrow: Man, I, I am so grateful for the way you've held me through this podcast. I feel like you have, uh, really done a beautiful job at like, touching on aspects of my story, creating like a cohesive narrative and, um, given me, so one of the, if not the best introduction I've ever been given. And I am, I don't, I don't think that there's anything specifically that we haven't touched on. I, I'm just, I'm so grateful for how thorough you have been. You, you definitely are taking, um. The, the role of interviewer with like a lot of reverence and I'm, I'm really grateful to have been a part of this conversation.

[00:53:50] Gwyn: Wow. Thanks. That means, uh, that means an awful lot to me and I deeply appreciate it. I do have one last question, and this is, I try to remember and don't always 'cause human. Um, I like to Wren Marrow. What excites you?

[00:54:11] Wren Morrow: Oh girl, it depends on the day and the season. I think what's been exciting me lately, this is the most winter response of all time. I've been excited to get cozy in bed and curl up with a good book, but I think they, that, that is a reflection of the season. I was like, I like went into my mind and I just was seeing, my friend, uh, recently gave me a ton of candles. She had like an excess of candles and I've been like lighting all these candles and like getting so cozy and that was the first thing that came to mind. And so yes, very, it winter. That's what I'm excited for.

[00:55:09] Isn't she a hoot? Oh my goodness. I just, I had the greatest time chatting with Wren and then also I got to listen to it again while I was editing and I just had so much fun. She is a wonderful person and truly her pictures are fantastic. If you can please book a session with her. I know I will the next time that I have the chance, whenever she's in the neighborhood, or maybe I'll figure out how to get to her because she is that good.

[00:55:37] Gwyn: Please go find her wrenmorrow.com. That's. W-R-E-N-M-O-R-R-O w.com. Or you can find her on Instagram or of course there will be links in the show notes. While you're out there cruising the interwebs, please come and find me@whatexcitesus.com. Please sign up for the newsletter so that we can be sure to keep in touch.

[00:56:02] And while you're at it, i'd love to hear what's on your mind, what your thoughts are about this episode and in general. Just shoot me a, Hey, what's happening? I'll respond. I love connecting. It's truly my favorite thing. What excites us is produced and edited by me. I'm Gwyn Isaacs. The music I use is under the Creative Commons Attribution License and is by Stephan Kartenberg and Julius h.

[00:56:29] Thanks so much for listening and be sure to do one nice thing for yourself today. Don't put it off. Don't wait till your to-do list is done. Just go do something good for you. You deserve it.