What Excites Us!

Episode 74: Stop Healing and Start Pleasuring with Sharon Marie Scott

Get your shopping on - using these links helps to support WEU!

Momotaro Apotheca For all Your Vulva Care needs and wants - use the link or code GWYN20 for 20% off

Agreeable Agony - Makers of Fine Kinky Play Items - use the link or code SEXFAIRYGWYN for 5% off - please support this lovely small business!

überlube- Only the best High Performance, body friendly Silicone Lube available! Recommended by medical professionals, sexologists and many households. Get yours here.

Toendi - Adult Toys by a manufacturer that cares! Use this link or code for 10% off your order!
Or code gwyn0122

Transcript:

[00:00:00] Gwyn Isaacs: What if the thing that you are most ashamed of, your personal taboo, is actually the fastest path to the freedom and joy you crave? That's what we're talking about today on this episode of What Excites Us! With Sharon Marie Scott.

[00:00:17] Gwyn: This podcast is about sex and sexuality, so please only listen if you are an adult without kids or other ears around that cannot, or do not consent to sensitive language and content. Thanks. In this conversation we also talk about the pleasure renaissance she is building. The idea of a pleasure ceiling, which honestly still think about and talk about regularly. And the book that she had just released when we recorded this last fall, since then, the first book, which is actually the second one that came out, has also been released. So please stay tuned for this wonderful conversation with my guest, Sharon Marie Scott.

[00:01:04] Gwyn Isaacs: Sharon Marie Scott is an erotic mystic, author, and spiritual innovator who's pioneering a new era of mastery through pleasure.

[00:01:14] She's the creator of the six book Hieros Codex series, where she explores erotic energy as the technology of creation itself. Sharon weaves mysticism, neuroscience, and sensual embodiment to show that pleasure is the body's divine language, a real compass for wealth, love, and liberation. Through her movement, Life Turned On, she's igniting a global pleasure renaissance, one that brings erotic embodiment and ecstasy back to the center of human evolution.

[00:01:50] We are going to talk about her new book, Forbidden Alchemy: Transmuting Taboo into Erotic Medicine, and what it really looks like to turn shame, secrecy, and too muchness into clarity, confidence, and embodied pleasure. Thank you, Sharon, for joining me on What Excites Us.

[00:02:11] Sharon Marie Scott: I am so excited to be here. Thank you for having me.

[00:02:14] This is gonna be so great. Mm-hmm. Let's just start

[00:02:17] Gwyn Isaacs: very,

[00:02:18] Sharon Marie Scott: like how did you get into this world of erotic mysticism

[00:02:23] Gwyn Isaacs: and,

[00:02:23] Sharon Marie Scott: and such?

[00:02:24] Yeah. what a great question. No one's asked me that question yet. I love it. Um, it, it was a series of events, right? So, you know, I was married for 27 years, and we opened halfway

[00:02:37] Gwyn Isaacs: uh,

[00:02:37] Sharon Marie Scott: that relationship.

[00:02:39] And in the process of opening up, we started to also explore our own erotic selves, right?

[00:02:45] Gwyn Isaacs: Um,

[00:02:45] Sharon Marie Scott: And that led to being also in the kink and BDSM community. So besides, let's say, ethical non-monogamy and the, and those kinds of multiple relationship or multiple lover, you know, uh, cultures, the kink community became a really, a real home for us.

[00:03:00] And in that, the taboo became a really wonderful teacher. And, and that was probably, I wanna say, more than 10 years ago, 12 years ago that I got into the kink community. And then five years ago, I had a supernatural experience that became a spiritual awakening. And I

[00:03:19] Gwyn Isaacs: I

[00:03:19] Sharon Marie Scott: was already at that time a leader and educator in the kink and BDSM, and teaching lots of things, and peer shares, and leading ethical n- non-monogamy discussion groups.

[00:03:30] But then when the spiritual piece dropped in- You know, I had to find a way to weave what was so foundational now to me into the erotic leadership that I was already uh, in front of. And it's been both an unraveling and a remaking, you know, in those last five years to get where I am now, which is this platform of life turned on, because mine used to be so turned off,

[00:03:55] Gwyn Isaacs: the

[00:03:56] Sharon Marie Scott: the concept of spiritual mastery through pleasure.

[00:03:59] Gwyn Isaacs: Yeah, I love that. I love that so much. What you are doing in the world speaks so much to what I am also doing in the world, and it's just, it's, ooh, it's tingly good, delicious.

[00:04:09] Sharon Marie Scott: I... That's funny, I literally just got an, full-body chills too, which is my guides talking to me. It's a fuck yes from my guides when I

[00:04:16] get-

[00:04:16] Gwyn Isaacs: Yes

[00:04:16] Sharon Marie Scott: those full-body chills. I love that we both got it at the same time.

[00:04:19] Gwyn Isaacs: Me too. That's so good.

[00:04:21] Yeah.

[00:04:21] Um, so let's talk about pleasure literacy. I haven't heard people use those two words together, and I love it. Yeah. Expand on that for me.

[00:04:31] Sharon Marie Scott: Yeah. Pleasure literacy is the first pillar of the movement that I'm calling the Pleasure Renaissance.

[00:04:36] So pleasure literacy, you know,

[00:04:37] Gwyn Isaacs: you know,

[00:04:38] Sharon Marie Scott: a couple of layers to it. One is just the idea of pleasure as a technology. So I believe that, you know, that we all

[00:04:47] Gwyn Isaacs: h-

[00:04:47] Sharon Marie Scott: kind of have a message to share with the world. We have a way to be in the world that is uniquely ours. You know, and people will call it purpose or dharma, and that's cool.

[00:04:55] You can use that language too. So, you know, how do we get to that? How do we find out what that is, and how do we get on the path to what our dharma is? And for me, the answer is pleasure. Because I come from a background of a being a writer in comic books and video games, video games are like a great way for me to describe this.

[00:05:12] Gwyn Isaacs: know, In my spiritual awakening that I mentioned, I realized that I'm not just the player character, the main player character in this video game that I'm living in, but I'm the game designer too. So again,

[00:05:25] w-

[00:05:25] Sharon Marie Scott: in the process of trying to find out

[00:05:27] Gwyn Isaacs: w-

[00:05:27] Sharon Marie Scott: what is the message that I'm supposed to share, which now I know is,

[00:05:30] Gwyn Isaacs: pl-

[00:05:31] Sharon Marie Scott: spiritual mastery through pleasure,

[00:05:32] Gwyn Isaacs: I, I f-

[00:05:33] Sharon Marie Scott: I discovered that by pursuing pleasure.

[00:05:35] Gwyn Isaacs: then, And then pleasure literacy on the other level is the actual using the body as the oracle. And so understanding like the,

[00:05:43] you know,

[00:05:43] Sharon Marie Scott: pleasure is a spectrum, for example. And I would say that it from the least pleasure, which is really about a relief of suffering and healing,

[00:05:52] Gwyn Isaacs: you know,

[00:05:52] Sharon Marie Scott: all the way through ecstatic pleasure.

[00:05:55] And so understanding how your body moves through that spectrum of sensation of pleasure, and then like how to challenge yourself, like hitting, finding what your pleasure ceiling is and then holding yourself there without collapsing- It, something happens. In the same way that people do shadow work

[00:06:16] Gwyn Isaacs: kind of

[00:06:16] Sharon Marie Scott: hold themselves,

[00:06:17] Gwyn Isaacs: know,

[00:06:17] Sharon Marie Scott: in the trauma moment,

[00:06:19] Gwyn Isaacs: you know,

[00:06:19] Sharon Marie Scott: without collapsing.

[00:06:20] And if they do that long enough,

[00:06:22] Gwyn Isaacs: the, the

[00:06:22] Sharon Marie Scott: the frequency kind of collapses, and you expand and heal, and you feel different. The same can be done with pleasure. You can find your pleasure ceiling

[00:06:29] Gwyn Isaacs: you-

[00:06:30] Sharon Marie Scott: hold yourself there.

[00:06:31] Gwyn Isaacs: And a-

[00:06:31] Sharon Marie Scott: And

[00:06:31] Gwyn Isaacs: the,

[00:06:32] Sharon Marie Scott: the frequency collapses and then expands infinitely

[00:06:35] Gwyn Isaacs: And

[00:06:36] Sharon Marie Scott: and it's not even healing anymore. At that point, you're, like, skyrocketing in your journey. And all the shadow work and stuff will still come up. But this is why I talk about pleasure and pleasure literacy and the pursuit of pleasure not even just the next evolution of shadow work,

[00:06:50] Gwyn Isaacs: like,

[00:06:50] Sharon Marie Scott: transcending shadow work altogether.

[00:06:52] Because we're no longer focusing on,

[00:06:54] Gwyn Isaacs: I,

[00:06:54] Sharon Marie Scott: I need to heal something," or being in the hamster wheel of shadow work. Pleasure

[00:06:59] Gwyn Isaacs: is,

[00:06:59] Sharon Marie Scott: that's the way you're gonna find your dharma. That's the way you're gonna awaken your consciousness. That's the way you're gonna

[00:07:03] Gwyn Isaacs: c-

[00:07:03] Sharon Marie Scott: call in your highest timeline.

[00:07:05] Yeah. So I have a lot to say about that.

[00:07:08] Gwyn Isaacs: That's amazing. I have three things that are totally related to what you just said and not related to each other First one is when you said, uh, game player and game designer, it made me think of the Hindu tradition, right, where it's, I don't remember the highest god, but he breaks himself up into a million different pieces, and that's how we have all these smaller gods and goddesses. I am n- not a scholar. I dabble in comparative religions 'cause I think it's fascinating 'cause they're all saying- Same ... the same thing.

[00:07:36] you know. And so that's really cool. Second thing, I am reading, uh, Dr. Gina Ogden's book, Women Who Love Sex.

[00:07:44] And this morning, I recorded a TikTok about how she was talking the spectrum of pleasure. it it goes from pleasure to orgasm to ecstasy. my question to and and Instagram and everybody was like, what are all the different places in between? Because-

[00:08:02] Sharon Marie Scott: Mm-hmm ...

[00:08:02] Gwyn Isaacs: those are just three points, right? So that's, that doesn't cover everything. So what it comes up for you. That's super cool. And then the third piece is that the work that you're talking about, the transcendent of the shadow, the almost we don't need it anymore, like we've gotten through it, makes me think of the work that Barbara Carrellas does in the world, and how the erotic is necessary. uh, you don't even need to touch genitals to have that same type of whole uh, experience and-

[00:08:33] Sharon Marie Scott: 100%

[00:08:34] Gwyn Isaacs: orgasm and all of that.

[00:08:36] Sharon Marie Scott: And arousal itself is the same energy, right? So it's just the sparking and the stirring of that creation energy. And then, and you can build that. You can build from that place.

[00:08:46] And it, you don't have to... You're right. You don't have to touch genitals at all. Just thinking of arousing things unlocks it, and then you can move that energy around and you can put it toward crea- creative projects or other partners or something else.

[00:08:58] Gwyn Isaacs: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And so that brings me how you talk about the erotic energy is the greatest creative force.

[00:09:07] Yeah. Yeah.

[00:09:08] It,

[00:09:08] Sharon Marie Scott: It's everything, right? It, our- Our spark,

[00:09:13] Gwyn Isaacs: you know,

[00:09:13] Sharon Marie Scott: our primal spark, that arousal, that turn-on, is an expression of creative energy. And not just fem- the feminine, right? We often overemphasize maybe the feminine's ability to create, and certainly we have a really, like almost more of h- a bigger bandwidth to that creation energy. That's true.

[00:09:35] But you can, like me sometimes having a creative block or writer's block, I can find things to pleasure myself. It could be actual self-pleasure, but it... I could stop for a minute and take a walk and see beauty and feel aroused and connected to the vastness of this reality and the beauty in it.

[00:09:58] Gwyn Isaacs: then, And again, that stirs the energy, or you can self-pleasure. But you bring it up, you bring the energy up, and then you leave it. Like, even if you're gonna actually physically self-pleasure, don't self-pleasure to climax, and then go back to your creative project, and I promise you it will unlock whatever the block was that you had.

[00:10:18] Sharon Marie Scott: So it's that potent of a force. And, people can think of something arousing right now while they're listening to us, you know? Or for me, like, I love to, like, how can I make this moment more pleasurable is often what I'm asking myself. A- anywhere. I can be sitting on a bus and doing it, and I can be in the bedroom and doing it.

[00:10:37] How can I make this more pleasurable? And I often, like, will touch my arm because I love goosebumps. And I really that the more sensation you can hold, it translates to the more, the deeper love you can hold, the more wealth and success and abundance that you can hold. And so I often will teach people how to tune into the different sensations separately, and then how to layer them.

[00:11:00] And what I mean by layering is, how do I open my sensation portal, which is really, like, my body, but it's my, the energetic complex, the ego complex, the spiritual complex too. So how m- how many times, how much can I open to multiple,

[00:11:15] Gwyn Isaacs: uh,

[00:11:16] Sharon Marie Scott: paths of sensation and notice them and feel them all at once?

[00:11:21] And the, again, the more I can do that, the more I can hold, the more vibrational frequency I can hold, the more abundance, the more wealth, the more love, the higher pleasure I can hold. It's such an exciting thing to talk I, I think what I'm finding,

[00:11:34] Gwyn Isaacs: at,

[00:11:34] Sharon Marie Scott: I'm at the beginning of that process of the book really.

[00:11:36] It's only been out for a couple of weeks. And what I'm finding is that as much as people want to, um, clutch their pearls perhaps at the topic, they can feel it. They can feel the truth of the message of what I'm delivering, And again, it perks their own desire. know? So that's the spark, you know?

[00:11:55] And that's, that's why I feel so strongly about not just the message of the book and taboo, you know, and transmuting taboo into medicine, to this larger global movement of the pleasure renaissance, of bringing it back. Like, taking us out of this, like, group survi- collective survival and comparison and all of that and uh, replacing that lens with the lens of pleasure. How can I fill my cup and then only live from the overflow of a cup that is already full?

[00:12:24] Gwyn Isaacs: Mm-hmm. Yeah, Absolutely. That is, yes, literally what I am working on as well. I definitely wanna talk about the book. Let's start with, um, the framework that you set up of the dark masculine and the dark feminine, because I think that's a really important piece that might be a little bit more challenging for some folks to wrap their heads around.

[00:12:44] Sharon Marie Scott: Yeah, absolutely. It was for me too as I was, like, framing the framework of the book myself. I wanted to understand the dark feminine and dark masculine better for myself, because I realized how much, how long I had been, um, moving through

[00:12:57] Gwyn Isaacs: I c-

[00:12:57] Sharon Marie Scott: I consider them energetic currents, right? So everybody has a light and dark masculine and a light and dark energetic

[00:13:04] Gwyn Isaacs: that,

[00:13:05] Sharon Marie Scott: that is available to

[00:13:06] Gwyn Isaacs: they're,

[00:13:06] Sharon Marie Scott: and we are moving through them whether we realize it or not, and it's just a matter of how aware are we that, of, of any one of those currents, you know, that we are in the middle of or embodying in that moment.

[00:13:19] So the light masculine and feminine all, have, uh, everything to do with kind of

[00:13:24] Gwyn Isaacs: sil-

[00:13:24] Sharon Marie Scott: stillness, comfort, soothing, you know, and a holding of each other that is very gentle. The dark masculine and feminine has to do with movement and annihilation, but, like, not annihilation or destruction from the standpoint of just being violent,

[00:13:43] Gwyn Isaacs: the,

[00:13:43] Sharon Marie Scott: in, like, the way that we purposely burn certain forests in order

[00:13:47] Gwyn Isaacs: the

[00:13:47] Sharon Marie Scott: the fresh stuff to come out.

[00:13:48] And

[00:13:49] Gwyn Isaacs: in,

[00:13:49] Sharon Marie Scott: in terms of the dark masculine and feminine, it's like,

[00:13:51] Gwyn Isaacs: the

[00:13:52] Sharon Marie Scott: the dark feminine energy is that, like, roiling, infinity, chaotic wildness energy that clears anything that isn't truth. So that the truth can emerge. And the dark masculine is the one that holds that container. He's like, "I can hold your wildness."

[00:14:12] And again, it's not a him specifically, but even within us, we do it all the time, all day long, we're doing this to ourselves for ourselves. But he can hold the container of her wildness, and in fact, 'cause if, if she's just wild with no dark masculine to hold the container, that's just destruction. If he's holding a container that has nothing in it, or he's not letting her move within it, nothing happens.

[00:14:34] So when the two come together and he holds this and, and then helps her direct that wild chaos energy. That's like our creation energy. That's when stuff happens. That's when one plus one equals three and new things are created, and people, both of them have the potential to And in this case, I'm actually referring to, like, two people in a scene, for example, a kinky scene, you know, where the, the energetic current of the feminine and masculine are both in coherence and with the purpose that both of them will expand from the interaction.

[00:15:10] Gwyn Isaacs: Yeah.

[00:15:10] Sharon Marie Scott: Does that help?

[00:15:11] Gwyn Isaacs: Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. And it naturally draws me towards, um, taboo as medicine.

[00:15:18] Mm-hmm.

[00:15:18] What do you, what do you... Most people think taboo is, "Oh, no, taboo. We don't go there." Right. "There's a reason we don't go there." Right. Why are you saying we should go there?

[00:15:27] Sharon Marie Scott: Yes. Because the work that I do, I was a multidimensional healer, you know, when I first had that spiritual awakening, and I transitioned last year because I didn't wanna be a healer anymore.

[00:15:36] I didn't like the language that we need to heal something. And so shadow work is a way to do the same kind of work, the healing work, but from the point of view of I'm still a victim of something, I'm, I have things to heal, so I'm not complete or whole, where going right to the taboo, especially from the lens of pleasure, it's like, oh, this is, this is a different way of approaching the unhealed parts of me, or the parts that I have rejected and have been fragmented from me, but in a way that welcomes them in a super sexy, delicious way.

[00:16:16] Instead of like, I need to heal. I need to hold space for anger. I need need to go to a rage room, a rage retreat or something, you know? it's the same effect, but through a, just a much more joyous and physically pleasurable container to achieve the same. And the results are actually, it- I would argue, uh, exponentially more expansive than the focus on the obstacles or the shadow.

[00:16:43] Gwyn Isaacs: Okay, tell me more about that.

[00:16:45] Sharon Marie Scott: Yeah, so 'cause the taboo... So I've been asked before, like, you know, "What is the definition of kink? What is the definition of a taboo?" And so it's, because it's such a subjective, the answer is it's sub- subjective, so how do we define it? For me, a taboo is anything in my reality based on my personal experiences that someone else would judge me for.

[00:17:06] Mm. And because people, because I'm worried, I'm coming from, again, like, this fear state, again, that's like the, an obstacle and, and separation and victim mentality. I don't share that with people because I'm afraid of their judgment. So that cycle is harmful to us from the inside out. if we can change the language, if we can change the cultural narrative around t- the word taboo, and we can see the taboo as, like my mouth waters when I say the word taboo.

[00:17:38] Like, literally right now, like my mouth is watering. So if, if I can inject a new definition of even the word taboo that creates arousal in people, and again, that like kind of naughty edge that turns me on, changing the cultural narrative over time, this is the Pleasure Renaissance, changes... Like, we have cultural narratives right now that say spirituality and sexuality can't live in the same space.

[00:18:04] We have cultural narratives that tell us that, uh, pleasure is an indulgence or has to be a reward instead of it being the natural way that we're living. And those narratives have been in place for so long that we have now created systems of government, systems of social order that dictate that, and continue that false narrative.

[00:18:23] And my approach is to have people take back their sovereignty, take back their language. And to think of the taboo as, I don't know, I, I, wanna say the slap and

[00:18:38] Gwyn Isaacs: I mean,

[00:18:38] Sharon Marie Scott: but I mean it in a good way. Their taboo is the slap and tickle that is inviting them to their next level of expansion.

[00:18:47] And so it becomes medicine, not just because you're f- you're con- I wanna say confronting it, but that's too strong a word. Like, not because you're just holding space for it, but because the shame that is usually created from our taboos, is pointing us our deepest core of healing.

[00:19:06] Like, when I was a healer, work, I explained my work in this way. I called it, it was bottom of the Jenga tower work. So if you think about a Jenga tower, there are blocks at the bottom of the tower. Those are our core wounds that happen, like, probably before we're seven years old, right? Early, earliest wounding.

[00:19:22] And they're complicated by other things that compound that early wounding. So those are the core blocks at the bottom of the Jenga tower. And then we develop coping mechanisms, right? And those are the blocks that sit on top of those base blocks. And you can work from the top of the tower down. Like, the top of the tower might be, "I don't know how to ask for a raise from my boss.

[00:19:41] I don't know how to say no. I'm a people pleaser." Like, those sorts of things. And you can get to the bottom of the tower eventually and find out what those core wounds are. Or you can go right to the bottom of the tower, pull those core blocks, everything that was built on top of it, all those coping mechanisms, will naturally dissolve on their own.

[00:20:00] So it's potent medicine to go right to the, like, the things that, the things you feel the most shame about are the are the pieces of you t- n- that are begging to be reintegrated, and you will see the biggest quantum leaps from

[00:20:15] I

[00:20:15] Gwyn Isaacs: just want you to say that last piece again. Yeah. The pieces of you that are- Yeah ... that are shameful.

[00:20:20] Sharon Marie Scott: Yes. Because we, because the taboo tends to come with the physical sensations and the label of shame, that going right to the bottom of the d- that bottom of that Jenga tower, right to the shame, and not just tolerating them or accepting your taboos, but celebrating them, that's why it creates the largest quantum leap in your healing journey or in your wholeness journey.

[00:20:47] Gwyn Isaacs: Yeah. So I'm looking at, I pulled a bunch of quotes from the book, and I'm looking at one that I pulled from page 42 that says, "Because y- that too muchness that you've tried to control, that's your magic. So take the leash off your desire. Let your untamed self return home. That wild is not what makes you unsafe. It's the suppression of it that is."

[00:21:10] Sharon Marie Scott: Right. It's what we talked about.

[00:21:13] Gwyn Isaacs: So how do we figure out

[00:21:15] Sharon Marie Scott: if,

[00:21:16] Gwyn Isaacs: if we are in such a space where we can't even see the bottom of the Jenga tower, right? If it's just like, ah, miles and miles long. How do we start to unchunk that in ways that are sustainable and will not just send us into a...

[00:21:36] Yeah.

[00:21:37] Sharon Marie Scott: Yeah. Well, I will say that the book has post-chapter exercises for so many of these topics, you know, primal play, blindfolds, restraint, you know, predicament play, power exchange. So there are gentle exchanges where you can start to introduce yourself to your own edge, to your own taboos. And then I have these, like, spicy or even spicier add-ons.

[00:22:00] So you can titrate your own experience so that you're not overloading your nervous system, right? So it didn't, and it doesn't even have to be, like, in the bedroom or in erotic play, you know, that you're doing this. It could be, it can be, uh, bedroom or in erotic play, you know, that you're doing this. It could be, it can be, uh, just in, in normal life, where you start to, poke at the, casing around you.

[00:22:25] Like, where is my edge? Where is my edge with the way that I communicate with my family? Where is the edge of how I dress on any given day? And you can start to, like... Y- it's about getting to know yourself. Like, if you, if you can't identify what the bottom of your Jenga tower is, and by the way, everyone can because we all have what I consider to be the same three core wounds, which is the core wound of rejection, abandonment, and unworthiness.

[00:22:51] So those are what we're tackling. And then, of course, those are expressed in those, with those coping mechanisms. So if you know you're a people pleaser, then you not people pleasing is you stepping toward your taboo.

[00:23:03] Gwyn: Fun fact, the first vlogger my honey and I bought together was a beautiful handmade leather piece by a nice small local company called Agreeable Agony. Over a decade later, it is still my favorite toy, and I'm happy to say that they're still around making toys and have grown to have an online website, so you don't have to go to an event to buy them.

[00:23:27] You can purchase discreetly from your home. And I'm even more excited to tell you that if you use my code Sex Fairy Gwyn or go through the link on my webpage whatexcitesus.com you can get 5% off your entire purchase. So go visit Agreeable agony today they have implement toys, wax books, rope. Things that you can learn from, things that you can play with, and all of it is super fun.

[00:23:56] So go visit AgreeableAgony.com today and be sure to tell them Sex Fairy Gwyn sent you.

[00:24:03]

[00:24:03] Gwyn Isaacs: I really loved the way that you designed the book, with all of the different versions of how to practice what we just read about.

[00:24:11] The, like, the soft version, and then the spicier version, and then the even spicier version, and the version, uh, that you can do with another person as well. yeah, it made it- Yeah ... very accessible.

[00:24:22] Sharon Marie Scott: And- Yeah, introducing a witness that you, you're mentioning. Introducing a witness is another layer of nervous- you know, that, that brings it up another layer. So even just, even just having the conversation with yourself is often where I start with it. There are even journaling exercises where you're communicating to yourself through your dark masculine and dark feminine.

[00:24:40] What that does is you're starting to be a better observer of what's happening inside your own system. When your dark masculine want, your dark feminine wants something, and your, you know, how willing is your dark masculine to hold a space for that? And then, and then of course that then can translate to in relationship and in connection in the bedroom and stuff like that, too, where you can start to actually play within the archetypes of the dark masculine and feminine.

[00:25:04] Gwyn Isaacs: Yeah. I loved how, um, I'm super kinky and poly, and I'm so steeped in this world, um, that sometimes I forget how much of a bubble it is.

[00:25:17] Sharon Marie Scott: Yeah.

[00:25:18] Gwyn Isaacs: And that what

[00:25:19] Sharon Marie Scott: I'm- Sista. I get you, sista. And what a privilege. I mean, what a privilege it is, honestly, to be living in this bubble.

[00:25:28] Gwyn Isaacs: Yeah, absolutely. Um, but then when I try to take myself out of that and come at it from, a person who has no experience, and frankly is frightened by the whole concept of it, I still was able to access the book with those eyes, because you do start in a very easy to understand kind of way.

[00:25:52] And yet, the stories that you are telling are almost all extremely kinky. Yes. And make it feel less terrifying and more accessible to people who are playing with kink and aren't really, accessing the deeper pieces that are available to them.

[00:26:10] Sharon Marie Scott: Yeah, I love that you brought this up. There's a this is also strategic, because it's my experience that, like it's a brave thing, it's a courageous thing to even take one little step forward toward your edge, right? So when someone presents to you a much larger sandbox, you realize that you're one step forward- is mild.

[00:26:35] So I purposely put in, stories that were more extreme so that people can realize that the sandbox is way bigger for them to play in. It's like I sometimes will tell this experience of a lover where I wanted to return to anal play, and it was after babies and things like that.

[00:26:52] So there was like, I was embarrassed and had some feelings about shame, and shame around it. So I wanted to approach him. So I was like, "Hey, what do you think if we like, take this one step forward and maybe play, maybe think about some anal play?" And I didn't know until he told me that it was nearly a fetish for him to play that way.

[00:27:10] And so all of a sudden, where I was just hoping that he wouldn't reject me, all of a sudden I had this mile-long sandbox that I got to play in that at least got to go as far as his fetish. Which was a big space, that suddenly instead of taking one step forward, I was free to fully surrender into this pleasure, this taboo pleasure that I was curious about and wanting to return to.

[00:27:38] Gwyn Isaacs: Yeah.

[00:27:38] Sharon Marie Scott: So that was the effort. To do the same in the book, that was the effort.

[00:27:42] Gwyn Isaacs: Yeah. I think that happens quite a lot in this world, that we get so wrapped up about what our proclivities are that we don't even wanna speak them to other people, and then we build this whole shame spiral circle around that, and then we get trapped in there. Whereas if we can just say a thing gently, even ask you know, "Can we talk about a thing?" More times than not, your partner is not going to just offhand reject you and kick you out of the house. You know what I mean? Like-

[00:28:17] Sharon Marie Scott: yeah, and there's this, there's a subtlety that you're talking about here, right? 'Cause there's both the arousal, 'cause clearly it's something that you wanna play in. There, so there's the arousal and there's the fear, both at once. And so, my recommendation, if somebody wants to talk to a partner about something that feels really edgy, is to first do some of the work internally for themselves.

[00:28:38] And of course, there's the work, there's the internal work, and then there's being witnessed, and those are two levels of I wanna say healing, but again, I don't love that language. But two levels of reclaiming a piece of yourself. And so I recommend first doing the internal work. Like where are the physical sensations coming up in your body that have to do with the fear?

[00:29:00] What are the physical sensations for the arousal? So first separate those. And sometimes they're blended, which is another super hot level that you can get to in your own taboo. And you start to become the observer of what's happening somatically in your body. And then if you can start to separate them and hold space for like if your stomach starts to get a little nauseous 'cause that's a fear response, you just notice the nausea and you go, "Okay, I see that that's..."

[00:29:29] 'Cause when you realize, like, the fear isn't something to, like, it's not gonna kill you. It's just a set of sensations. Nausea, maybe your throat gets a little tight, maybe your face gets a little flushed, maybe your chest gets a little tight. You start to just name the actual physical sensations, and before you know it, the nausea's gone because you've held space for it without letting your nervous system collapse.

[00:29:52] So then you're left with more of the arousal. And when you go to your partner, if you're going to your partner full of excitement and arousal instead of embarrassment- ... you know, the mirroring neurons are your friend right? So you go to them and say, " I am so eager to share this thing that really turns me on with you, and I want you to know that I'm super nervous, cause I, I worry about judgment, or I worry about, I feel embarrassed to share too."

[00:30:20] So you can be really frank before you ever share with them that you're bringing to them something that's gonna be really vulnerable. And a good partner is gonna be like, "Wow, that sounds really hard. Let me, let me be present." And that doesn't mean that they're gonna want to do that thing with you or whatever. That's a whole different conversation.

[00:30:36] But just the approach. Be transparent about both really excited and, I really wanna share why this is juicy to me, and maybe you don't know, but it is juicy to me. I wanna share that it is juicy to me, and I'm also feeling really nervous because of rejection. I'm afraid of abandonment. I'm afraid you're gonna judge me. I think that transparency goes a long way to what happens in that conversation.

[00:31:00] Gwyn Isaacs: Absolutely. And then for the folks who are interested in stepping into the kink world- and are using your book as a type of guide towards that

[00:31:12] Sharon Marie Scott: I just got a chill. I just got a chill. I love that idea.

[00:31:16] Gwyn Isaacs: You brought up a bunch of things that I've heard quite a lot. People who have identified some sadism but are terrified they'll take it too far. And on the other side, people who are interested in perhaps being submissive but are afraid that they will lose themselves completely.

[00:31:31] And then for the couples who are like, "How do we power exchange but not all the time because we have a life?" Right? So there are all these different threads that you talk about in a very beautiful and spiritual way without being too much of any of that.

[00:31:47] Sharon Marie Scott: Thank you for saying that.

[00:31:49] Gwyn Isaacs: You're welcome. Yeah, it really struck me. Can you give just a little tidbit towards some of that? I want people to go get your book, but also to know what they might be in for when they get it.

[00:32:00] Sharon Marie Scott: So what's the question specifically?

[00:32:01] Gwyn Isaacs: How to- Um, relax about- mm ... the fears that they are holding.

[00:32:10] Sharon Marie Scott: Speak the fears out loud, for sure. That's helpful. Notice the body's response. What is the set of sensations that come up when those fears come up? And then, you know I wish I had great references for books for people to do this kind of play. That's why partly this, I wrote this one, right?

[00:32:28] This is the book I wish I had. There are other books, like The Control Book or topping, The Topping book, I only know one book on power exchange that does not assume the dominant is a sadist or that the submissive is a masochist, and it's called Leading and Supportive Love: The Truth About Dominant and Submissive Relationships.

[00:32:52] And I remember reading it, and I was like, "What's so different about this book?" And I realized, oh, especially here in the San Diego community, it is, there's a big assumption that all dominants are sadists. And so when women come in and want to be a submissive, they think, "Oh, I have to like being flogged," and none of those things are true.

[00:33:09] Those are separate things. There are gentleman doms. There are pleasure doms. So that book is a particularly good reference for to, for you to really understand the foundations of what it means to, like, say, lead and yield, to be in a leading and yielding relationship. So let's see.

[00:33:24] So how did they get in? I would recommend starting to find your local kink events platform. So for a lot of people, that would be FetLife, which is probably your readers already know, but like it's like a Facebook for fetish, right? Fetish life, FetLife. And then another one would be the Plura app.

[00:33:46] P-L-U-R-A. Plura.

[00:33:48] FetLife is really wonderful for events. The website itself is another story. But the Plura app is really quite good for events as well, event listings. But the foundations of the Plura app are tend to be spiritual, kinky, and multiple relationships.

[00:34:06] Sharon Marie Scott: I haven't found another app that feels so home, so like home to me than the Plura app. So certainly I would look... and some meetups as well. Even Meetup will have these, these gatherings now. So I recommend looking for seeking out local community and starting to go to events. Go to the meet and greets, go to the coffee munches, go to the discussions, go to the workshops.

[00:34:31] Like here in San Diego, we're so blessed because we have a nonprofit named Club X, and they have like 13 workshops a month. New member orientations, discussions on polarity play. You know, hard skills and soft skill workshops. And they also socialize after the workshop.

[00:34:48] And again so as you go to start introducing yourself to community, and lots of rope by the way. San Diego's huge for rope. And rope is another wonderful gateway because they play in public spaces. Like when I started, even though I was married, my husband was building our first business together, and I was going alone.

[00:35:05] And so public rope was a safe place for me to go and start to introduce myself to the community, get tied, and but in a public and safe environment where, you know, I wasn't trying to say yes to somebody and going home, and then who knows what could happen from there. So get involved in your local community.

[00:35:24] Go to the social things that are tending to happen after the workshop, and start to mingle amongst people who embody this and who live this every day. And ask questions and learn and you know get online, get online to these, to

[00:35:39] to these kinky groups and ask questions. In fact, there was a group I was browsing through this morning that a woman came on and said, "I'm so embarrassed to bring this up, but I'm starting to get into the dating pool again, and I realize I really love piss play. What I've heard is that if I find a guy who's into piss play, that it must come from trauma. And so I'm so worried about being in a relationship with somebody who has trauma."

[00:36:02] I have so many thoughts about that, right? One is that- the definition of trauma, Gabor Mate, his definition of trauma in the documentary The Wisdom of Trauma is essentially when you are approaching a present moment as if it were the past.

[00:36:19] That simple definition, every single person on the planet has trauma, and I would agree with him. So, like, you can't get into a relationship with anyone who hasn't had some form of trauma by that definition. And then the piss play part, it's like there are groups on FetLife that you can join. And that's what I was encouraging her. I'm like, "Get on FetLife and join a group, and look and see what a delight some people get out of piss play." You can start to talk about it within the context of the group.

[00:36:49] I used to go to a kinky camping event every summer, and there was a woman there that loved piss play. She also loved piggy play and mud play. So we set up a scene for her. She was thrilled. And so she laid in the dirt naked, and we all took turns peeing on her. 'Cause piss play is not necessarily my thing, but I certainly was there to hold space and see her in her pleasure. That's really one of my fetishes, seeing people in their pleasure regardless of what it is.

[00:37:16] So she laid in the dirt. We all peed on her. I went first so that I wouldn't chicken out. And then whatever, there was probably eight, eight or 10 people that did that. And then that, our, our urine created mud, for her, and she rolled around in it. And she was, she was thrilled, not only by, not only by being in her pleasure, in her fetish, but by being witnessed and s- celebrated in her pleasure, in her fetish.

[00:37:41] And again, it's, that takes it to the next level that witnessing piece. So you just have to Be brave enough to love yourself more than the fear of judgment, and start mingling amongst people who think like this and who embody this more liberated way of living inside and out.

[00:38:05] Gwyn Isaacs: Yeah. And get your book, because your book-

[00:38:08] Sharon Marie Scott: And get my book.

[00:38:10] Gwyn Isaacs: Start with- Really Start there. Yeah, it was really great. Yeah. And it talks about polyamory too, and how-

[00:38:15] Sharon Marie Scott: Yes ... the- Forbidden ways of, yeah. Mm-hmm.

[00:38:17] Gwyn Isaacs: There's so many different avenues in your book that are fantastic. And I'm not done yet. I just wanna make sure that I put that in there.

[00:38:25] Sharon Marie Scott: Thank you. Thank you.

[00:38:26] Gwyn Isaacs: The last piece that you were speaking to, brought me to this other quote that I picked out, which was, "You are not here to find the one. You are here to become the one."

[00:38:39] Yeah.

[00:38:40] Sharon Marie Scott: Yes.

[00:38:40] Gwyn Isaacs: I mean, I know that. Mm-hmm. Reading it like that was just beautiful and sat with me.

[00:38:46] Sharon Marie Scott: Well, thank you for reading the book then.

[00:38:49] Gwyn Isaacs: Oh, no, I read the whole thing. Thank you ... marked it up. It was wonderful. But when I read that line, that, "You are not here to find the one, you are here to become the one," I really had to just let that sit and drink my tea and just let it just wash over me.

[00:39:04] Because again, even though it is something that I know intellectually, feeling it- Yeah ... is entirely different. So I'm presuming that pleasure plays into this, being that I'm reading it in a book about pleasure. I don't know. What's your path to becoming the one? How can we approach that?

[00:39:23] Sharon Marie Scott: Yeah, and the truth is you are the one. So it's really about peeling away the veils and the layers that are keeping you from the knowing of that. And in our society, it tends to be, like, a heterosexual, monogamous, lifetime pursuit in relationship, and we don't tend to recognize the collective childhood wounding around rejection, abandonment, and unworthiness that is the fuel for that pursuit.

[00:39:53] Hmm. And so we are constantly reaching outside of ourselves to feel complete and whole. If you understood that everything you're reaching outward for is something that is an unhealed piece of you from inside, all you really have to do is do the internal work. And when, once you... Like, let's say I'm looking to feel safe in a relationship, which again, when we're talking about that spectrum of pleasure, is way at the bottom of the spectrum.

[00:40:23] So I just wanna feel safe in a relationship means you don't feel safe within yourself. If you're a woman and you're heterosexual so you're pursuing a man, what usually that means is I have an unhealed masculine wound within me- That is creating this outward ripple in my reality. When I start to show up for myself differently, when I make myself feel safe from within, that's my masculine that's the light masculine.

[00:40:52] When I let myself feel safe from within, like, oh, I have all these emotions, and then I criticize myself for having emotions, that's a distorted masculine, and it doesn't make you feel safe from the inside out. And so your reality will absolutely automatically reflect that conflict. When you resolve it from within and start being kinder and speaking kinder to yourself from within, back and forth, both of them, you will watch your outer reality reflect that shift.

[00:41:19] And so that's the essence of You're Meant to Become The One. It's really a pursuit of the Hero's Codex, or Heiros Codex, I don't know how to say it, people say it differently. But the Hero's Gamos Journey is the sacred union journey. And people tend to also bastardize that, to think that that means a sacred union with another person.

[00:41:42] And that's part of the path, but it starts with the sacred union with self. And to accomplish that is to heal the masculine and feminine aspects, those occurrence from within. Sacred union with self then leads to the sacred union with other and sacred union with all. And that's the journey. Like, the last four books of my six-book codex will be a more direct path on accomplishing that.

[00:42:10] So again, this video game, you are the god of the game. Your body is the console. Your pleasures are the cheat code. And the journey is about recognizing that you're, you are the one

[00:42:25] Gwyn Isaacs: Fucking love that Yay So good. It's so good. Oh, yeah, beautiful. Um tell me what the Pleasure Renaissance looks like on the collective level.

[00:42:39] Sharon Marie Scott: Yeah, 'cause this is, A big movement, even for me. I come from poor circumstances and very small ideas. And so this is a really big idea, and I don't even absolutely know yet how all of it will be accomplished. But I believe in the spirit of it. I believe that spirit will drop in the resources for me. So it does have these pillars. We talked about pleasure literacy. Erotic alchemy is another which is threaded through our conversation today around the taboo as medicine, for example, and sex magic.

[00:43:11] The third one is sensational aliveness. Like again, like returning to the body. Self-worship and returning to the body. Like, what pleases my body, including like my eyes. Like, what is beautiful? You know, what tastes really amazing? Like having an orgasmic meal, you know? i, I want to plan like retreats where people get to have these sensational experiences.

[00:43:33] So sensational aliveness is part of it. The fourth pillar is, uh, regenerative community, and which includes wealth, like regenerative wealth. Which what that means is we participate in a community on purpose the way we contribute radiates out in a synergistic way. Again, like the one plus one equals three kind of concept where I'm gonna participate in community in a way that gives to the community, and the community itself expands.

[00:44:01] So again, a less self-centered. And there's a paradox here, right? We're doing self-worship. We're doing this wholeness pursuit, this heiros gamos, sacred union with self journey from the inside out. And so it sounds selfish, which I replace with self-yes.

[00:44:17] But in that pursuit of loving one's self and then participating, there's sort of this natural pendulum swing that happens, like why I began in the alternative lifestyles communities because I was so transformed. I have never felt so alive. It was like natural for me to give back. And so that path, that journey to becoming not just whole but like radiating in overflow. Now I give back to the community.

[00:44:44] That becomes a regenerative energy. And then the last pillar is what I call myth-making. And that has to do with I'm gonna start pulling together forward-thinking media industry, right? I've, I come from comic books, video games, film, and fiction, so I'm gonna start there, right? I'm gonna pull together innovative, spiritual pleasure seekers like me to say, what kind of legacy are we leaving behind after we're gone?

[00:45:16] So let's start producing games and TV and movies and other media that center pleasure as the pursuit of happiness and steer away from these conversations around separation and fear-based living and victim and perpetrator mentality.

[00:45:37] In the pursuit of that, I also have a couple of global initiatives for people to be aware of, which is female genital mutilation and child marriage. Like, pleasure is a birthright, and That, that message needs to be spread globally. And Forbidden Alchemy is a piece of political activism. It's pleasure activism. Because people that know their pleasure and know how to satisfy themselves are less governable by systems that use fear and control to rule. So that was actually why Forbidden Alchemy came out so much sooner.

[00:46:12] My first book is actually coming out in February, the first one I wrote. It's called Flesh and Flame: Pleasure as the Portal to Divine Mastery. But because of what's happening politically here in the United States, we pushed for Forbidden Alchemy to come out first because we feel it's a really strong piece of political activism. So I hope people will share the book for that as much as anything else.

[00:46:35] Gwyn Isaacs: Yeah. God, so good. So juicy. I love how aligned we are. It's really, really delightful.

[00:46:41] Sharon Marie Scott: I love that too.

[00:46:43] Gwyn Isaacs: For the person who is like, "Yes, I really want all this, and I have no idea what to do," can you provide them with one simple step towards walking in this direction?

[00:46:58] Sharon Marie Scott: I would call that self-worship or sacred sexuality with self. I would start setting aside one night of your week to have a date with yourself. And it's not even so much about, like, a self-care routine, like I'm gonna, I'm gonna massage my own body, or I'm gonna give myself a bath, or I'm gonna make myself a meal, although I recommend all of those things.

[00:47:19] I'm gonna self-pleasure. Yes, do that, too. What's even more important, 'cause I do it in the everyday. Like, my self-worship is I don't even drink out of a can or bottle anymore. This body, this vessel deserves a goblet or something really beautiful to drink from, I even have my blingy, you know?

[00:47:35] Gwyn Isaacs: I love it.

[00:47:35] Sharon Marie Scott: Water bottle, right? So it's less about the things we're doing and more about how we are being present in the moment with ourselves. If you're gonna go get a pedicure... people are like, "I get pedicures and then it still doesn't feel like self-care. I'm still exhausted." Well, it's because you're not being present.

[00:47:51] It's how you're inhabiting the moment while you are getting the pedicure that is the problem, right? 'Cause we have this tendency to, like, "Oh, if I do the thing," which is a masculine driven way of thinking, "If I do the thing, it will fix this problem." They're ignoring the being part.

[00:48:06] How am I being? If I'm in a pedicure and all I can think about is, you know, I have to pick up my kids at school and this is not happening and I have money worries, you're not receiving the medicine. So going into the body, taking a breath, closing your eyes, feeling the air on your skin for a moment, feeling the warmth of the water if you're getting a pedicure. That's the self-worship. That's the medicine for that moment, and that's the difference.

[00:48:36] Gwyn Isaacs: Yeah. Lean into the pleasure. Presence.

[00:48:39] Feel it. Yeah. Really embody it.

[00:48:42] Sharon Marie Scott: And thank yourself, right? Self-pleasuring, you get to both receive from yourself, and you get to thank yourself for the beautiful way that you're caressing and touching your body.

[00:48:52] Gwyn Isaacs: Oh, that's juicy. Yeah, I love that. I really love that. So if people want to learn more, besides buying your book, how do they find you? Yeah What are you doing in the world?

[00:49:04] Sharon Marie Scott: Yeah. My website, sharonmariescott.com, is certainly a great place to great portal in which to find me. I do have IG and TikTok accounts. They're Life Turned On or Sharon Life Turned On. YouTube as well, Life Turned On. I'm also on Substack, and I write regular blogs and articles there. I do have a paid subscription as well, where I drop guided activations, and some of which are quite sexy. Those are the major ways to get ahold of me. I mean, i'm early in the pursuit of being more visible. And so this is a good time for people to reach out to me right before life changes. Come bring a book and I'll sign it. You know, I would love that. And yeah, reach out.

[00:49:44] I've got more things I'm planning a 12-week program in the spring where I will be sharing my private temple practices and sex magic rituals for the first six weeks. And then there's a live, there's an actual in-person retreat where we do the embodied work about learning how to receive. And then there are integration weeks, and then a closing ceremony. So they're very sacred containers that I'm creating.

[00:50:06] Gwyn Isaacs: Beautiful. I like to end every episode of What Excites Us with Sharon Marie Scott, what excites you?

[00:50:15] Sharon Marie Scott: Hmm. Today? Mm-hmm. What excites me today?

[00:50:19] Gwyn Isaacs: Right now.

[00:50:20] Sharon Marie Scott: I feel so blessed and on purpose. It just feels like a privilege that I get to bring this global message. It's such a ripe time for it. You know, to counter the unrest that we're all experiencing. And so I'm excited at- All the people who are on the edge of wanting to pursue their taboo or their pleasure, who will be tipped over into the direction of themselves by this conversation.

[00:51:02] Gwyn Isaacs: Beautiful. Thank you so much. This has been really, really wonderful.

[00:51:05] Okay. What did you think about that Jenga metaphor? It's good, right? Really, really good? Really good. So listen, go check out Sharon at all of her places. You can find her at sharonmariescott.com or Linktree, Sharon Marie Scott. Also come find me at Whatexcitesus, and please, if this conversation is interesting, sparks something in you, if you like it, rate and review or share.

[00:51:33] Let's help get these messages out into the world so we can continue to heal one at a time. Thanks for listening. You're awesome.